View Full Version : Psychology and Psychiatry - and Where They Fail

May 4th, 2009, 03:25 PM
People so often ask...

"Where are psychologists and psychiatrists all getting their information from?"

The answer is that they are relearning how to remember a consistent universal truth, and ironically they all wind up with Ph.Ds or MDs and build careers around various levels of their own awarenesses and realizations, some having far less access than others.

Most tend to redirect anyone escaping or otherwise removed from convention, its expectations and rules of reasoning right back into it, instead of guiding them higher and further into enlightenment, and that is often because they, themselves, aren't aware enough to appreciate the importance of universal truth. It's like sending a sick person to live among "permanently incurable" sick people, instead of offering a cure!

There are "official mental illnesses" that are, in actuality, behaviors and responses of people too removed from convention to go back, with those folks having no idea what is even happening to them to go further, or to even know to, or know how to, ask for additional or alternative help. Medicating those behaviors and responses away and trying to send those folks back into a convention they can't live in, or have never been able to bond with, leads to a lifetime of their being labeled as having a "mental illness," and their lives and dreams for themselves shattered. It also leads to tangled neuronal pathways that never had to be, but that are then used as "evidence" for the original misdiagnoses!

It is really a sad, sad situation that so many sitting around the streets or institutions with their lives in ruin and their families heartbroken are not being heard and appropriately assisted because the therapists and other mental health workers themselves don't know how to hear or process reality!

Let this be a thread for the discussion of psychology/psychologists and psychiatry/psychiatrists, (and other mental health workers), relative to the processing of convention vs truth.

May 4th, 2009, 04:22 PM
My sisters daughter is caught up in the mental health system in the UK as she has had a problems for a number of years now. They started off with her taking so-called soft drugs and although many call for the legalisation of this drug, she has suffered many mental health problems because of it.
Instead of offering her counselling and support and trying to get to the root cause of her issues, they pump her full of more drugs, force her to go into the psych unit and then let her home again afterwards!!
This girl is just 29 years old and has lost custody of her child because of the arrogance of some so-called doctors who are too arrogant to think or know there are alternatives out there!!!

Sorry for the rant!

May 7th, 2009, 03:05 PM
That is a sad situation for her, and since most people have no idea how to get around "therapists" who have founded their careers and reputations around convention and its expectations, she could be caught up in that system all her life!

Psychiatrists and psychologists are too often thought of as cultural deities having some sort of magic that others "have to" accept blindly. After all, they have a piece of paper or two with their names on them and some sort of official stamp. But inside of all that is very much the same "old boys' school" fear of scientists that not following those conventional expectations of crossing every t and dotting every i will lead to ruined reputations, careers and tenure, and the end to funding, such as research grants.

It seems truth always has to wait throughout human history for something major to happen that jolts people awake a little more (however temporary, as usual) to cause those who are more highly evolved to be taken seriously, and then just as reality gets to spring forward a bit, there is a rush back to complacency yet again to claim that space for the comfort of denial.

So, those who are able to see through it have a responsibility to speak up, and keep speaking up.

May 7th, 2009, 03:56 PM
Yes I agree with a lot of what you have said here and I am afraid my neice is caught up in the system now and can see no way forward for her.
As you say, it will take a few brave souls willing to stand up and speak out about these things.

Lion Spirit Walker
May 8th, 2009, 04:00 AM
Two points that may be of some interest. Both psychology and psychiatry fully except human psychic abilities and study such abilities at great length. I know this from personal experience.
Second. You may find the book "Voluntary Madness" by Norah Vincent of some interest.

May 8th, 2009, 08:22 AM
Ok...thanks for sharing there Psyche :)

May 8th, 2009, 09:42 AM
I have studying these area's for years,
All I found is that they are pawns for new world order,
thinking they can sit down with a stranger and tell
them what to and what not to think, which I see this as a
hidious crime,attacking our freedom at base level -
they are expanding thier drug pushing to passify any resistance
to thier goal of keeping the population under controll,
now testing out thier controll drugs on young children if they
are "too active.", what children are, and hopefully always be.
There are those who have a stake in this controll, which means political
power and billions of dollars each year.
I have never seen them acctually help anyone, and thier education
if very sorely outdated.

May 8th, 2009, 05:39 PM
I have studying these area's for years,
All I found is that they are pawns for new world order,
thinking they can sit down with a stranger and tell
them what to and what not to think, which I see this as a
hidious crime,attacking our freedom at base level -
they are expanding thier drug pushing to passify any resistance
to thier goal of keeping the population under controll,
now testing out thier controll drugs on young children if they
are "too active.", what children are, and hopefully always be.
There are those who have a stake in this controll, which means political
power and billions of dollars each year.
I have never seen them acctually help anyone, and thier education
if very sorely outdated.

I see psychiatry and psychology as still in a rudimentary state.
Hmmm. I don't believe in an intended conspiracy, for a "New World Order", but I think it is human nature to organize. I do see the world and its cultures always organizing. I don't see this with the intent of trapping everyone in a large exclusive bureaucracy akin to the Cyborg ship. But I believe things do organized themselves to complexity. It is my theory that all complexities shatter or unravel after reaching thresholds of their ultimate complexity. I do not believe the universe will ever reach any form of real stability - even after its presumed death, after expanding to its limit.


May 9th, 2009, 05:32 AM
The united nations has allready decided to use mental health to controll
the masses, the drugs were invented in Nazi Germany to controll political prisoners,handing over the research done then was part of the conditions of stopping
the war.
As far as phychiatry recognizing anything paranormal, you must
have run into some wierd sect, as EVERTHING paranormal, or spritual
is documented as mental illness and they will force drugs on you if you
tell them about it.
I can appreciate where you are coming from and I wish it were true,
Alot of phycologists recognize the paranormal, but as for phychiatry
they try and fix it, so you better fit the norn, and they are not nice
about it if you resist.
Maybe you people just don't beleive me, but I see this as a threat
to all that is sacred.
Less than half of the people, in good physical health never leave an institution alive, and these are
not criminals they just did not like such an invation of their peronal being.

May 9th, 2009, 08:19 AM
I see your point, DangerBird, my friend. I am reminded of the movie 'One Flew Over The Cookoo's Nest' Where one man's normality and free-spirited behavior was taken as a form mental illness. Perhaps this is what could happen to freethinkers. But I wouldn't get paranoid yet; I think there is still hope for us as a society.

May 9th, 2009, 01:25 PM
The main flaw I think with psychology and psychiatry is that they are rooted in ego...they aim to get you to have a 'healthy' functioning ego. Certainly, a placid and relatively 'functional' ego is better than an unbalanced and dysfunctional ego...

But it's still ego. It's a fabrication of self. It isn't who - or rather what - we truly are at a deeper level. And egos are inherently quite disruptive and dysfucntional - with all this need to feel better than or less than others, the very notion of 'others' as being separate from ourselves. All wars and conflicts are rooted in this ego and the desire to validate it by creating enemies and 'us' and 'them'.

A much better alternative is to simply wake up from what Einstein called this 'optical delusion of consciousness' and become what we truly are. You don't need a healthy relationship with yourself (that implies duality 'you' and 'yourself'). Just ditch the false self and BE WHAT YOU ARE.

I don't suppose the masses are quite ready for that, I guess. But still, I stand by my assertion that psychology is extremely limited because it operates solely within this illusory sense of self called ego. What we truly are is so far beyond that.

May 9th, 2009, 03:06 PM
During the teens of the 20th century, a German drug company was founded in NYC and grew into the monster we all know of today ... Pfizer.

The company's world headquaters are just a hop, skip, and jump away from where I live. The immediate vicinity of the company's two locations are really nice, clean, and kept up; but the surrounding neighbourhoods are like ghettos, filled people who are striken with health problems and mental health issues. Articles on the company's 'great achievements' and 'contributions to the community' are written up in the local paper all the time. The company is always buying artwork from local, national and international artists. The company always has a 'pretty picture painted' of it all the time for the public's eye.

I have personally met some of the former chemists of the company and indirectly as well .... and as far as I am concerned, and perhaps my view is tainted and biased, but to put it bluntly ... it's all about selling drugs and making money and has nothing to do with 'caring' about people's mental health, period .... and that's why and where 'they fail' in our view.

May 10th, 2009, 03:10 PM
There are hundreds of theories concerning mental health, the only
reason the drug method is so popular is , as said ,it makes alot
of people rich.
You may like to look around the web concerning "schizoprenia and shamanism"
The experts agree that what is called schizophrenia was (and by some
still) shamanisn...but then claim it is primitive superstition.
I've seen alot of good people's lives ruined by phychatric drugs, it's
a wonder there isn't all kinds of violence here.
I am writing a kind of education for those that gifted with this, but
cannot find any real truth about it, most modern response is " insane
or evil ", a person just cannot function if he/she beleives these things,
but the answers are hard to find, and are repressed by those money
Christ, Pual, any budda or anyone who beleives and practices a working
religeon/philosophy all fall into this catagory...and others who were found
in a vulnerable position also often get this treatment.girl_witch
peace and love

".. I never bowed to the laws of the thought police,
I take a holy vow, never to kill again."
Neil Young.

May 10th, 2009, 07:03 PM
I don't see any kind of conspiracy going on within psychology, psychiatry or even science, for that matter.

My formal education is psychology, including physiological psychology (what's in the brain, what it all does, how drugs work, etc), and clinical and research/experimental, in addition to philosophy and religion, math, physics...it all winds up in the same place at the top. At least, it is supposed to, but that doesn't always wind up happening.

What IS happening is that convention has a stronghold over these fields of study because it is the majority rule that determines what is accepted as "reality," and who gets and keeps their jobs and tenured positions, as well as the enormous monies for research grants and other funding.

There is a fear among these fields, and a legitimate one at that, that not towing the line of convention and its expectations will result in one's career and life's work and education being ruined, and that one's colleagues will frown on anyone who tries to raise the bar higher than the collective is ready and able to go.

Not all medications prescribed are frivolous and irresponsible ads for making money. Disorders are the result of imbalances in one's neurochemistry, caused by the brain's overproduction, or underproduction, and everything in between, of the neurotransmitters needed for being healthy. Too much serotonin or dopamine in one patient causes certain problems, while too little of them in others cause other problems. Medications are intended to help what takes place in the synapses, the area where two neurons meet to communicate, based on whether the patient needs more or less of a certain neurotransmitter. Sometimes, when more than one medication is needed for more than one problem a patient is having, the mixing of those two or more substances can create additional side effects, and that brings on the cause for additional medication to deal with those side effects. All of this is appropriate and anyone reading this who has been prescribed medications should NEVER stop using them without consulting one's doctor(s) or seeking additional opinions from additional medical professionals. The reason for not stopping drugs is because abruptly stopping them can cause serious harm, because the body needs what it depends upon and isn't yet able to process its needs otherwise. So, by no means stop your medications without consulting a physician.

Yes, there are issues of abuse with drugs in the medical fields, with doctors passing out drugs on the very first visit, or hopping from one to the next, or over-passing out samples, etc., but there is abuse among all fields of expertise, as well as everywhere else, so doctors who are doing their best should not be categorized as unscrupulous when that isn't called for. Life demands a lot from people, and medications help a whole lot of people out there be able to work to support themselves and their families, live happier, more productive, more socially satisfying lives!

Psychologists, not allowed to prescribe medications no matter how much they have formally studied them, have fought for a long time for the right to be able to give medications to their patients. Personally, I don't think they should. That is what MDs (psychiatrists) are there for.

As for schizophrenia, there are various types and levels of schizophrenia, as well as lesser schizoid behaviors, and it is a real shame that it devastates lives of patients and their families, and medications such as Thorazine and Chlorpromazine, among others, are needed to help those who have psychotic episodes to be able to function in everyday life. That is all very legitimate. You can actually see schizophrenia under a microscope! Medications help millions of people lead better lives.

However, having said that, it IS a serious issue within the fields of psychology and psychiatry, and other related mental and social health networks, that people are too quickly assumed to have conditions that, when observed more closely, by more learned, more realized, more responsible professionals, are actually conditions of circumstance, such as, as I mentioned to begin this thread, folks' realizing themselves out of the walls of convention, struggling to survive in their own realizations against everyday pressures to conform, with no one anywhere in their lives to help them realize what is actually happening to them, and no education or exposure at all of their own to be able to communicate themselves more accurately. When even extremely Conscious individuals, such as the Dalai Lama and his colleagues, can't even communicate higher realities to convention, surely those with various levels of awakening, and with a long way yet to go, and having no education or access to assistance otherwise, are not going to be very successful at it, especially if they can't even tell themselves!

This is where the problem begins to show itself, because for folks such as that, psychiatrists and psychologists need to rise above themselves and their career fears and overtly assist these folks toward understanding what is happening to them. When they are in denial themselves, or given their degrees and careers without their own realizations needed to genuinely *get* folks like that, the whole system begins to break down. People who are way too realized to "go back" into convention, if they ever had been, wind up caught between a rock and a hard place. They can't move forward because they don't know how, and they have no idea how to communicate where they are to those around them, including family, those at work if employed, neighbors, friends, etc... Their differences are mistakenly deemed aspects of "mental illness" and they are socially and professionally harmed by this. The result: lots of families in trauma, broken relationships, ruined careers, institutionalization, homelessness, drug addictions, etc...

So, no, there is no real conspiracy to drug people or keep them drugged, and no conscious intent to further victimize those who are victims of convention and its misguided reasoning. There is simply a phenomenon of comfort in denial, of field (outer/other) dependency that is profound among scientists and medical professionals to CONFORM to CONVENTION, complete with all the tragic consequences that result.

Therefore, those who are genuinely Consciously Enlightened have a responsibility to work toward change, toward awakening, toward exposing those problems, no matter how unappreciated, misunderstood, condescended upon, ridiculed, rejected, or lonely it may become.

Awareness on a universal level comes with the responsibility to elicit selfless change! The fields of psychology and psychiatry, among others, including science, have a responsibility to step out of convention, collectively, on behalf of the millions who trust and depend on them, no excuses otherwise!

May 12th, 2009, 12:03 PM
I can appreciate much of what you have to say,
there is 8x the dopimine in in the brain of "a schizophrenic",
what they don't tell you is that are also more dopomine receptors
which makes me beleive that there is no chemical unbalance here,
just a difference, they really are not any different from anyone
as people, but the experiences they have are, and it is sad that our
culture does not tolerate this type of non-conformity.
As you must know what they call schizoprenia was revered in many
cultures for thousands of years, and these people did not get the
respect of being councellors to kings and chiefs and healers to the
poeple, by being screw-ups.
These phychiatric medications leave many physically disabled,and often
dead, and from
what I have seen, they lower brain capacity to the point of being
zombie-like,when on the average before treatment the majority of them
had above average i.q.'s and as a group there are far less violent
acts performed as compared to society as a whole, so where does
this fake justification of potential harm come into play, generally
exibiting an unusual act, and hey..why not..who needs the boredom,
results in forced drugging, which is supposed to be against the law,
but is ignored as the "pro's" need not answer to anyone as to thier
reasoning for this forced drugging, which is being forced upon more
and more sections of society as time is going by.
These drugs are not meant to cure, but to controll, the "patient."
I find this a tremdous crime in a society that is supposed to value freedom.
In the past, the elder shaman would teach the next generation, this
teaching is almost completely lost, and the poor soul is left with being
called evil or insane, treated this way, and sometimes comming to
beleive it, which in itself may cause a great deal of phychlogical tramma.
80% of the poeple who are forced drugs refuse them, are arrested and
forced to take them...if these drugs actually do help, I really do not
beleive that they would be refused.
Another problem is that the top phychiatrists on earth, have never agreed
on just what schizophrenia is, yet there are drug companies doing
research on how to controll it...as well as a list of 10,000 symptoms,
which make it very easy to certify almost anyone with this illness.
I have watched too many people suffering from the effects of these
drugs; emotionally, physically and mentally handicapping them to ever
agree with the approach that is being taken.
There are many who were lucky enough to be warned about phychiatry,
who have the two basics, visions and given to hearing "voices" who\
are leading normal lives, working raising children ect.
These people do not really want to be found for obvious reasons, but
are proof that this phychiatric profiteering is just that.
There are many nurses that went into the field thinking they would
help people, after a while they see they are not, but are trapped
in thier jobs, you can't just quit a job these days, with the new
labour laws.
It seems like the doctors think they are doing good, but I seriously
wonder how they can miss the fact that they are no help at all,
it would have to be a very serious case of something to actually
be helped by drugs that are made to shut down parts of the brain,
maybe we want to use our whole mind, why is that anyone else's
Peace and Love,