Beliefs & belief systems

[BlueStar]

What are your, um, beliefs about beliefs and belief systems? Help or hindrance? Real or mere mental abstraction? Do beliefs help us get in touch with reality or do they in fact come between us and a pure, direct experience of reality?

[BlueStar]

"Belief is the death of intelligence. As soon as one believes a doctrine of any sort, or assumes certitude, one stops thinking about that aspect of existence." Robert Anton Wilson

"There is nothing that isn't true if you believe it, and nothing that is true, believe it or not." Byron Katie

"Do not seek the truth, simply cease to cherish your opinions." Zen saying

Some quotes that kind of sum up my feelings on the topic of beliefs (which is of course a belief in itself ;)). I will have more to write later. Anyone else?

[Kiran]

I think if something works for someone and gives them help/relief/advice then its all good. What I cannot condone is people criticising them or trying to hurt them for that belief.
As long as something works for you, and it harms no one else or it preaches no harm to anyone else, then I have no real issue with any faith/belief. What I really have zero tolerance for is ignorance.

[BlueStar]

Absolutely Lorri, I think that comes down to a basic level of respect that is very often lacking in the world. We each inhabit our own world and have (or should have) the freedom to think and believe as we feel is right. I'll never understand why people feel the need to control others and make them believe/think/behave in the same way as them. Well, actually I do know...it's all about ego, surely.

[Kiran]

... and have (or should have) the freedom to think and believe as we feel is right. I'll never understand why people feel the need to control others and make them believe/think/behave in the same way as them. Well, actually I do know...it's all about ego, surely.

I agree totally honey! Its all about compromise and accepting differences but that those differences are what makes us who we are...they can define us as a species but as you rightly said its about ego.

[Narnia]

Dang it ... you beat me to it ... I wanted to create a thread called ... 'This I Believe'

Will post more when I have more time to spare ... :D

ps: wonderful thread by the way!!

[BlueStar]

Hehe, great minds! ;) It's a vast and fascinating subject. I look forward to hearing your thoughts - and everyone else's.

I think my intent in creating this thread was to ask the question - are beliefs a help or hindrance when it comes to living our lives?

They're unavoidable I think - our entire 'map' of reality and the very structure of our mind and ego is built on thoughts and beliefs. I think the problem is when we forget that beliefs aren't reality - they're a normally second-hand, mental construct that we use to try to understand reality. And it's so easy to become prisoner to our beliefs.

What tends to happen when we get lost in beliefs is:

1. We no longer tend to think about or be open to further exploring the area of our belief. We might become close-minded and close-mindedness almost always leads to a closed heart.

2. We strongly dislike anyone contradicting our beliefs and/or messing with our version of reality. A lot of our energy gets syphoned into defending and maintaining our belief structures, which in turn solidify the ego sense of self. This is the cause of pretty much all the conflicts and wars on our planet. The desperate attempts to maintain, solidify and propagate our belief systems and maps of reality.

Is this an unavoidable part of being human?

Maybe...until we learn that we have the ability to question our thoughts and our beliefs. Most people still lack the self-awareness to see thoughts and beliefs as simply thoughts and beliefs, and continually mistake them for objective reality rather than merely subjective interpretation. This is what is sometimes called 'unconscious living'. Developing the ability to stop identifying with our mental activity and to see it for what it is...is really vital if we are to live in peace with each other, ourselves and with life.

I used to have an assortment of beliefs. I still do believe certain things, but I don't think I'm quite as attached to them now. I'm a lot more fluidic now. I try to avoid taking on second-hand beliefs, I like to be able to check things out using my own experience. I've come to see beliefs as very fickle and arbitrary things. I've used Byron Katie's Work technique for a couple of years now, in which you take any troubling thought or belief and begin by asking 'is it true? Can I absolutely KNOW that it's true?' What I've discovered is that there's virtually NOTHING you can absolutely know is true. We make assumptions based on what we're told and what we've experienced, but there's so few of our even most-cherished beliefs that we can absolutely know to be true.

Knowing the tendency to be get trapped in beliefs, I endeavour now to make this the way I approach life:

I am open to everything, yet attached to nothing.

[Lion Spirit Walker]

My simple answer... Both.

[Rana]

What are your, um, beliefs about beliefs and belief systems? Help or hindrance? Real or mere mental abstraction? Do beliefs help us get in touch with reality or do they in fact come between us and a pure, direct experience of reality?

wow i love these questions and ponderings ..ill answer in my individualness ..i feel such a unique question needs my individual response .. some will say their beliefs are their feelings ..some will say their cultural beliefs are what they believe in .. some will only allow space for one way of thinking and feeling. are beliefs knowledge ? are they wisdom ? or more so is it wise to have beliefs ? since the begining of the human mind has one created what is described as beliefs which really in simple words are thoughts related to something .. like someone witnessed a birth for the person watching the birth lets say the mother of the girl giving birth she may have many feelings happiness she is to see life come and be a grandmother, feelings of fear for her daughter ( because of her own past experience), elation in the moment of creation. but what if in this society an unmarried mother was frowned upon, she was considered unworthy and a disgrace to her family , her mother may be affected by this imposed belief system contrary to her own internal belief system she may have feelings of fear for her daughter for what may happen, fear of how she may be treated, how the child will be treated. in some cultures in times gone the baby would have been in this case considered a curse , a devil , that this mother would have brought shame to her family and broader community, she may be banished. so we can see how belief systems have power ..when used for the good and with unconditional love can bring harmony and unity.when used to control and bring fear does divide and segregate.
so i feel as we enter the true new age we will have this wisdom to know the power of beliefs when they are created in every moment .. to know what is right and what does not serve us well xx

[Rana]

.. and it is to be noted that many suppressive belief systems paved the way to great risings in societies because people began to reject what didnt feel right and question it . so in the above example the young mother who imaginarily is living in a society that frowns upon babies being born out of wed lock , but is in a society where she may be yes judged but still be able to exercise her own free will and allow for her own personal beliefs and inner self to emanate reguardless to out influences (belief systems). so she may just say " too bad ..im happy and the baby is healthy thats all that counts " .
yet in many societies past and even in the now societies in this example may punish a person , their families also. or she may be punished by her family. of course this is only one example ..but there are so many scenarios that can play out in your mind alone.. 101 avenues of thinking ..related to belief ... and as stated above .. a belief can only hurt when used to create control and to supress ..not bring unity and love xx

[Jester Black]

What are your, um, beliefs about beliefs and belief systems? Help or hindrance? Real or mere mental abstraction? Do beliefs help us get in touch with reality or do they in fact come between us and a pure, direct experience of reality?

belief systems give us something to strive for. an avenue to become more than we are. it isnt a matter of whether they are real or not, but whether there is something more than we are. and in that context, belief systems are vital to the evolutionary process of sentinent beings as it provokes thought beyond the arrogance of intelligence and helps to avoid the cancer of stagnation, the death toll of any sentinent race.

[BlueStar]

I've really enjoyed reading what everyone has to say! Thank you for sharing. It is a vast and fascinating subject and something that is integral to all our lives

[Lion Spirit Walker]

Should I impose my beliefs upon you?
Should you impose your beliefs upon me?
Isn't doing this harmful to us both?